226: Using Strategy to Inform Your Marketing
Michele 00:00
Hello, my name is Michele, and you're listening to Profit is a Choice. Joining me today is Brooke Chapman. She's the executive director of Three by Three and Nine Boxes. Brooke has a proven track record in helping small businesses really create a strategy around their marketing. Today we're going to be talking about strategy versus tactics in your business with regards to marketing. Brooke uses a phrase that made me laugh, she calls it random acts of marketing. That's when we're just doing tactical work instead of strategy work. So listen today and see if there are some changes that you can make to your business to be more strategic.
Michele 00:49
Every day, empowered entrepreneurs are taking ownership of their company financial health, and enjoying the rewards of reduce stress and more creativity. With my background, as a financial software developer, owner of multiple businesses in the interior design, industry, educator, and speaker, I coach women in the interior design industry to increase their profits, regain ownership of their bottom line, and to have fun again in their business. Welcome to Profit is a Choice.
Michele 01:24
Hi Brooke! Welcome to the podcast.
Brooke Chapman 01:26
Thanks for having me, Michele.
Michele 01:28
It's my pleasure. So Brooke, I know where you are. But our listeners, don't, so tell us a little bit about where you live, just because it's so fun and interesting. And they're going to pick up when you start talking with your accent. But also tell us a little bit about your history and your the business that you've created. And what brought you to this.
Brooke Chapman 01:47
Yeah, sure thing So look, I'm based on the east coast of beautiful sunny Australia. So we're right in the middle of our summer at the moment, it is very warm. But yeah, I'm on the Gold Coast. So a beautiful part of the world. I'm very lucky, but quite a far way away from you. Yes. And then a little bit about our history. So I started my career as a TV journalist, I moved into some corporate communications roles, I worked in public relations, before making my way into being a marketing manager and a CMO for some very large corporations. And I met a couple of colleagues that were in similar roles to me. And what we noticed was that large businesses have got a really solid foundation for marketing strategy. They've got someone like me, and marketing strategy and their business marketing strategist in their business looking after it for them. But small to medium businesses don't have that. And so what we see a lot of the time is that these businesses, they find it really hard to engage with marketing in a meaningful way, they usually engage with it tactically, and they're sort of what we call engaging in random acts of marketing. And they can waste a lot of money. So the three of us developed a framework called the Nine Boxes, which is specifically designed for SMBs, to become more strategic with their marketing and to stop wasting money. And, you know, now we've had over 6000 SMBs go through our program, and we work with people all over the world. And it's just what we love to do. We love helping business owners to achieve their growth goals through a very strategic process.
Michele 03:13
Okay, so that was a lot. And I love it. All right, everybody that listens, knos, I'm all about strategy, strategy, strategy. And, you know, we talk about it all the time, even it in my in my home. We're doing some remodeling this year. And we're starting to have some of the different trades people come in and give us quotes for things to figure out. Like we're talking floors, and kitchens and entire two storey fireplaces, like we've been in our home for a long time. Well, if we were to just do one thing, as all the designers know, do things out of order, or just do things randomly, it's going to cost us a lot more to go back and rip it up and do it again, like we were looking at doing wallpaper in one of the rooms and then we realize some of the furniture especially it's a powder room, everything's got to come up, walls, including the vanity that we have, because of the style, the vanity to do the floors, which means we're going to rip up the, you know, the wallpaper. So we know all the time in our regular interiors, business or soft furnishings business, that there is a pathway there is a strategy to get from here to there. In business, though, I'm like you a lot of the companies that we have served and that we have seen, they don't have a lot of strategy around their business around the business plan. And then they certainly don't have if they don't have a strategy around the business then it's rare that they have a strategy around marketing or have a strategy around financials or operations or anything else. And so we see a lot of like you said tactics before strategy, and then they're wasting money because they're have to redo it. For them, it's the same as telling a client if you keep buying cheap furniture at some point, you're going to just buy 10 cheap sofas, you could buy one great so Find this that same idea. Before we go too far, though Brooke share a little bit about the definition, the difference between tactics and strategy, just in case there's somebody listening for the first time, and they're like, these terms are new to me. And I don't know what you mean.
Brooke Chapman 05:15
Yeah, sure. And a really great question. Because quite often, we come into businesses, and we explain to them what strategic marketing is, and a lot of the time they go, wow, that's just not what I expected. I thought you guys were brochures and campaigns and videos and Facebook. And we are so much more from a strategic standpoint. So you know, we think about marketing tactics, it's channels, it's your website is, you know, the suite of brochures that you're handing to clients. It's your social media pages, it's the campaigns that you run through Google. But if we think about what strategy is, it's really about understanding your market position and your differentiation from your customers. How if you were to plot your market on a map, where do you sit? Are you in a glut of cost of competitors? Or do you sit on your own with whitespace? And customers? No differentiation? It's things like doing customer insights, do you really understand your customers? Have you spoken to them? Do you have an in depth understanding of their behaviors, their needs, their desires, their purchase pathway, their, you know, their triggers, need to understand all that your vision and your values, you know, all of those sorts of what we call the really meaty strategic concepts. And if I use a interiors or sort of housing analogy, it's those foundations, you can't build a house without foundations. And we see a lot of businesses that are out there engaging in marketing, and they just do not have the strategic foundation. So you know, a lot of them have an understanding of their market. And they just jump straight into that market, we need to have the business strategy, we need to have a marketing strategy before we engage with tactics.
Michele 05:26
That's so good, so even in my Aim with Intent, Methodology that I use to coach my clients, the very first foundational piece of solid foundation, and we're looking at mission vision why, values, like, who are you as a business, right? What are those things? Because the truth of the matter is, it is so difficult for me or any of my team to guide them to move forward to even find the right marketing strategist to work with in the first place. If we don't even know who they are, like, how do you how do you decide to price if you don't even know who you are. So that foundation serves as the backbone for everything, not just to build your business strategy, but I love how you said to build the marketing strategy all of them. And but people usually think here's what the pushback I've gotten, I don't know, if you've gotten this, sometimes the pushback I get is, I just don't have time to sit down and figure that piece out. I'm just so busy. Designing, sewing, working upholstering selling whatever it is they're doing. But that's going to run dry at some point, if you are you're going to stumble, or not even make the money that you could make, or you're going to have the wrong clients come through the door. If you're right, and you're going to you're going to be in some yucky situations. If you can't take a step back and say, who do we want to be? And who do we want to serve? And how do we serve them in a phenomenal way that sets us apart?
Brooke Chapman 08:15
Us? So Right? I do get that a lot. And we always counter that with can you afford not to do this? Can you afford not to can you afford to be in market and be in business today without clarity. Because if you're not clear, your customers are not going to be clear. And the whole thing is compromised. So it takes there's no doubt about it. It does take some time and some investment to get that right. But once you do, basically everything else is easier after that every decision you have to make because you've laid those foundations, you understand who you are as a business and where you're going. And then you understand what's in the strategy and what isn't. It's very, it makes it very easy to say yes or no to things on that basis. So it's definitely an exercise that smart businesses go through. And we would recommend that all businesses go through.
Michele 09:00
I love that because clear is kind right clarity makes things so much easier. Like now we can build a process because we're clear on who we are and who we serve. The process could be very different. I mean, just another home example. We just had a guy come in to talk to us about redoing our floors. And we were talking about do we want to rip out the hardwoods or do we want to refinish the hardwood? What do we want to do on the stairs about the balusters and he was starting to ask us clarity questions, if you will, how long are you going to be in the house? You know what, how much money do you have to spend? Where's the best spend you have a better spend of the money here than you do over here because this is your long-term strategy to only be in the house for this long. So even within that that small conversation. It was about clarity on where we're going. I see a lot to of people starting these businesses because they love what they do without any idea of where they're going. So they just kind of find find themselves in a place. And I get it, I get it right, we can do that at the beginning. But at some point we have to take ownership of this is where we are. And that's where we're going, we'll never see the gap, if we don't know where we are, and where we're going.
Brooke Chapman 10:14
Yeah, look at the businesses we see out there that are successful or that are sustainable, and that grow year on year consistently, are the ones that have a strong direction. And they're the ones that you don't have to stick doggedly to a strategy, we all have to adapt and change things as as markets change. And as we evolve as a business, but you do need to have those fundamentals in place around who you're serving, and you need to be pretty picky around that. Strong businesses don't serve everyone. And that's a trap that a lot of small business owners fall into, it's really hard to say no to that sales, so I'm just going to do it. But every sale you make, just to kind of non ideal customer is taking you away from the ideal customer. So you got to get really selective around that. And it's just that clarity, if when you know where you're going, you're clear, you're able to communicate that to your staff, and your marketing is able to be so much more impactful with your audiences. Because you know, that clarity just sort of trickles down. So incredibly important to get that right from the outset.
Michele 11:12
So how long does it usually take when you work with someone to get that strategy in place? Before they start doing right? Like, what are some of the things that the listeners are listening today? And they're thinking, Okay, I want to at least start considering my strategy. Maybe before I reach out, or before I call somebody? What are some of the things they would look at? What would they start by doing?
Brooke Chapman 11:31
Yeah, it's a good question. It's not an overnight solution, right? Good marketing, you know, everyone's looking for that, that channel, if I could just find that that campaign or that that avenue that I can start running and the leads just flow in and you know, all my problems are solved, it doesn't work that way. That's why we've got this framework, there's nine areas within the framework, and you need to be improving across all nine of those areas to be a successful business with a strong growth platform. So it does take time and investment. We, we work with businesses over a series of months, but you can do an initial gap analysis over around four weeks where we work with clients and look at right, where are the gaps in your marketing strategy. And then we develop a 12 month roadmap after that. So you know, initial four weeks to determine where the gaps are and how to close them, then we work with you sort of coaching basis for the next 12 months to really get you where you're going. Because what we find is that you can develop a plan, but quite often, and particularly, you know, smaller businesses, what do you do that plan minutes developed, you need to know how to stop these projects, you need to know how to get over hurdles when they appear. And then you need to make sure that everything's done to a really high standard. So you need some coaching. So we sort of hang around and stay with the business over a period. But I guess to answer your question around the things you can do, the three most impactful things that we see businesses can do to change from tactical to strategic, are around reviewing and refining your market position. All of it is the most important of the nine boxes position. And if you don't have position, right, you kind of can't get anything else. Right. So that's a really critical one.
Michele 13:01
Right there and just define what market position is. I think sometimes. And I say that, right? Because I think sometimes we use phrases and keywords that we know. But for some people, this is going to be so new. And so I just want them to eat too, even though I think there's even a clarity around market position. That that could be like an aha for them.
Brooke Chapman 13:23
Yeah, you're right. And we do get asked that question. So market position is really around how you appear to your customers and how you project yourself. What space do you occupy in the market? So you know, if you look at a market you're engaged in, and you know, who are all of your competitors? And what are the similarities and the differences. And what we find with most markets is that there's a couple of different scales that they operate on. There are a few things that split the market apart, it might be whether you're a local provider or a national provider, it might be you know, whether you have a very select niche range or a very broad range. It might be whether you the type of clients that you serve, so you need to really look at the type of business that you are compared to others in the market. And do you have enough that differentiates yourself? And is it clear? Do customers understand the benefits of working with you, as opposed to one of your competitors? And you know, if you've got a strong position, that will be very clear. So yeah, that's really critical. And, you know, an area that that you need to focus on from the outset.
Michele 14:26
Perfect. Yeah. And then and then there were other things you were gonna say.
Brooke Chapman 14:30
So yeah, another thing is really doing customer insights. So a lot of businesses are turned off doing research because they just see dollar signs, I think it's going to be really expensive. But it doesn't have to be that way. You can do a really tight research project and get some good insights to base your marketing strategy around. So you might get a research company to speak to, you know, 12 to 15 of your customers do you know 30 minute in depth interviews, and we can normally get enough insight from that to be able to answer the question Students that we've got em build a marketing plan. So you know that that can give you a lot of great information. And then once you've got that information, mapping your buyers journey, so, you know, depending on your customer set, you know, you might, if you're doing office outfitting, that's gonna be a very different client to if you're doing a high end home renovation, the buyers journey is gonna be different, the decision making process will be different, what's important to them and the problems that they're solving a different, so you need to map that out for each customer group that you serve. And once you've got a strong understanding of that, then you know what channels you need to be involved in the message that's going to resonate, it gives you that clarity to make decisions and be really effective. So they're the major things that we work on with clients in those initial few months.
Michele 15:47
So in the client journey, I'm curious how detail do you go when you're thinking about it? And which way do you think about it? Do you think about the client journey? From, as you said, our deliverables to them? Do you think about it from their decision making? Are you thinking about it from communication, touch points, there's so many different lenses, if you will, when that's the thing, right? There are so many different lenses, when we look at any data or any information, we can put on the lens of the business owner, we can put it on the lens of the consumer, we can put on the lens of our subcontractors and providers, we can look at it from a tech perspective, we can look at it from where they live. I mean, they're just like, there's 1000 lenses we could put on to look at that same information. What are some of the ways that you look at it in your role?
Brooke Chapman 16:37
Yeah, so I think the first thing is, rather than just around customer mapping, we need to think of it as stakeholder mapping. So you mentioned a really good point there around contractors. So you know, they're going to be a key influencer in this process. So we actually, we need to understand their journey as well, and how they engage with you, as a major stakeholder and an influencer. We need to think about it from early on. So brand salience is so important. Consumers need to be aware of your brand, and they need to be aware of you, before they get to the decision making point, if they get to the decision making point, and you're not even in the game, it's too late. So what's the buying trigger? And you know, what, what makes them you know, determine that they need to renovate their home, or they need to do some sort of refurb. And then we need to be present at the point that that that considering that. So, you know, by doing those customer insights, we can really understand, well, what's going on in someone's life before they make the decision to redo their home. And then we can make and then we can say, Well wait, how what does the research look like? And you know, are you on Pinterest? Are you on Instagram looking at things? What does that look like? And then we can make sure that we're present in that moments that matter. And we're advertising in the right places, and we've got the right message. And then they go right, I've seen this ad a couple of times I think these guys are in are in the right spot for me, they understand me. So we really need to understand that behavior from early on. And then we can plot the journey right the way through. So it's, it can be a complex process. That's why we recommend that you work with a strategist, they've they're experienced in this and they'll be able to make it look simpler and easier for you. But it is it's so powerful when you understand that journey, and you know exactly where you need to be and when.
Michele 18:15
It's so interesting. You know, we I'm sure we all at some point, have had people say to us, oh my gosh, I didn't know you did that. If I hadn't known you did that I would have hired you. I can remember having my window treatment company for years. And in 2008, nine, we had the big recession and all of that here in the US. And after it everybody was calling. Are you still in business? Many people were you know, are you still there, because the landscape shifted so dramatically. And there is nothing worse than having a good friend or having somebody that you would love to be a client of yours is an ideal client. And they forget because you're not in front of them at the time that they're making the decision. That's why you know, we often hear things like if you're going to be in a magazine, you need to have an ad at least for a full quarter or you got to be there three to five times, and you can't just show up one time blip and blip out, you might get a hit. But it's because somebody was already ready, and you just happen to show up. But a lot of times people are thinking I mean, even us we're not planning on doing our reno for probably six months. And we're in the information gathering phase right now. So people are, they're not always pulling the trigger at the time that they're doing the research. And so whoever is in front of us when we're doing the research will be one of the ones that we use when we pull the trigger on job.
Brooke Chapman 19:41
Oh, yeah, look, I would say it's 1% that I'm flipping through that magazine and see that ad for the first time and go, I'm going to ring up or I'm going to go on that website and I'm going to order that then. It's very rare that that happens. What happens more often is that you need to see and message a number of times, it's on average seven times you need to see an ad before it starts to sink in. And also, the other thing is that you want to see that ad, the way that our brains work, you need to see it across a range of different channels. So you see that press ad in the magazine, but then you're also something up on Instagram, and it's, it starts to embed. So you need to think not just about the message and the frequency of it, you need to think about different channels, so that you're able to get the message across effectively in a short space of time. So that's all about your channel planning. But again, if you understand that journey, and the fact that the consumer is looking at the magazine, and they're looking online, then you're able to make sure you're present. And all of those places are so much more effective and impactful than just, you know, the one off press ad and hoping that the phone will just start ringing like that.
Michele 20:48
Well, and then also making sure that the messaging is clear. And that it is the same message that they're getting, maybe it's a different format, but at least the message is the same. You're not selling one thing over here and something completely different over here. So that they get a mixed message and are confused as to who you are and what you do. So just keeping things tied together in a way that is strategic is a big deal.
Brooke Chapman 21:14
Yeah, that consistency of message is huge. And again, it all comes back to those insights. Have you actually spoken to your customers? Of course, you know, what you're selling, you know, if you're selling flooring, you you're selling rugs, or you're selling cushions, but what problem are you solving for the customer? And when you ask that question, it's amazing what comes out. And then you're able to have really crisp messaging, which speaks to their problem gives them a solution, as opposed to just selling product. companies that sell product typically don't do very well, that when they're selling a solution, it's a different proposition.
Michele 21:45
And I remember having to embrace that I say having to because back in the day, it was, you know, you need to be out there and you need, you need to be putting your face out there, and you need to be doing all these things. And I couldn't remember getting just a little bit angsty of, oh my gosh, I don't really want to have to keep like self selling, like selling myself, right. And then it through some study and some other things. It was like, you know, wait a minute, I'm not, I'm not doing that what I'm doing is solution providing. So the more that I can tell you forget who I am, this is the problem my company solves. And if this is what you need, then we can be there to help you. But it relieves the stress of feeling like it was me that I was selling, I'm selling a solution. And I think it least for a lot of us on the small side of businesses, those that might have one or two people involved or three to five people involved, it can still feel very personal when we're doing our marketing. So being able to kind of separate the personal from the solution providing really gives us an insight and it actually gives us a boldness to go forward differently. The minute I realized, Okay, wait, wait, wait, this is the solution that I have that is that works because I've got the backup for it. Right? As they say, I've got receipts, I know this works. Now I can go out all day and sell a solution easier than I can walk out there. And uh, Hey, my name is Michele, why don't you come work with me, I'm really fun. Like, we're going to have good time looking at your finances like that. So that's not going to do it, right. But when I say I can make sure you get paid, you can sleep at night, you can have money in the bank and be able to pay your taxes, then they're like, Okay, now you got you got my attention. Can we talk?
Brooke Chapman 23:27
Yeah, you're so right. My marketing is really, for me, it is addressing an unmet need. And that's why I think so many people get it wrong, you know, you think about the problem that you're solving. And, you know, in your, in the case of your listeners, you know, their clients are looking for someone that can take this pain away, I'm overwhelmed and don't know where to get all of the bits and pieces, I don't know where to get the contractors, I'm just not sure of the collision, I don't know how it's going to hang together help. You can take that away. And you almost are given when you realize that you're problem solving, you're giving a solution to a customer, it gives you permission to then be able to have the right messaging. And it is impersonal it is about really just solving their needs.
Michele 24:06
You know, I think that to our piggyback on that for a second. I remember, I used to think that marketing and sales was a bit I didn't like the flashy of the 80s that really, you know, heavy hitting. But when you do realize that you are just solving a need in the marketplace, you are providing a solution for need, then you're not browbeating anybody, you're not twisting their arm, you're just saying you've got a problem and I can solve it. Let's work together. And then they're either drawn to you or repelled by your messaging. I mean to me, I want them to self-edit, so that I don't have to say we're not a good fit. I want them to read it and go, Oh, that's not what I was looking for or that that's not in alignment with what I need. It's so much easier when the messaging that we put out is so very clear that people read it and go, Oh my gosh, she's using my words and speaking my language she's talking to me, or oh, not my cup of tea.
Brooke Chapman 25:03
Yeah, look at attracting customers that aren't aligned to your business model and really need to be sold and really need to be, you know, kind of dragged across the line, that's just not good business, that's setting yourself up for a really difficult customer service problem down the line, because they were never right for you to begin with. So again, being really clear on who you serve, and who you don't, and filtering them in and out accordingly with strong messaging is so important for you know, your, the sustainability of your business, and for your own mental health, you know, me once customers that are going to become a problem.
Michele 25:39
Yeah, because you know, what, I've had people that we start talking in a discovery call, right, so they've, they've heard my name, seen my information out there heard the podcast, all the things we get on the phone, and then it's almost like, they're wanting me to resell myself to them. And I can tell right there, you made the comment about customer journey a minute ago, their customer journey is going to be very different through the program, than somebody who comes to me and says, I've taken advantage of all the free resources I've been following you, I've done the work, I'm ready to engage their customer journey is going to be a completely different journey than that first one. And it took me a while in business, I've been in business for 23 years now. And for myself, but it took me a while to understand that first one that's constantly making me prove myself, it's going to be a fight for the whole time that we're working together, like it's not going to be handled with ease. And so therefore, it's going to cost me more to service that client to get the same type of outcome that I could have with a different client. And when I when I caught that, it's so much easier now to just go, we're not the best fit. We're not the best.
Brooke Chapman 26:56
Because they're not ready, right? Like, you know,
Michele 26:58
it might be. It's not always that they're not great people. A lot of times, it could just be timing. I've even had some that I'm like this feels like it feels like we're cramming a solution in, why don't you wait, and then let's talk about it, right? Oh, give yourself six months. And then maybe we can revisit this and I've had some that combat and sign and they're like, Let's go because they're ready.
Brooke Chapman 27:21
That's what I was going to say, I think you get so much more. And ultimately, the customer gets so much more from you just being honest and saying, Look, you're not ready, where our program works really well is when you've got these things lined up, and you're ready to engage, and you're ready to invest time. And you know, that they will remember that. And they might we regularly have that conversation with customers that just aren't quite ready for us yet. And quite often, they'll go away. And they'll speak to other people they know in their network and recommend us because I go, you know, they were really honest. And they said I wasn't ready, but you should use these guys. And then yeah, they might come back in six months, and they are ready. So you've got again, you've got to stay true to the business you are and who you want to serve. And you're just saving yourself a whole heap of harder that sort of down the line.
Michele 28:05
So Brooke, if we do all this, I know that even being in my in the coaching space for the last 10 years. The messaging the client, and the offerings that I have today are not the same that I had. When I started right businesses evolve. We made a comment about that a minute ago that we can build a strategy, but they still have to have space to evolve and to move into change. How often do you see this? Or let me let me ask it this way. For businesses that start like doing the process that you had, after that year? How what does that journey look like their marketing strategic journey look like? Like, is it about three years in they revisit something and they tweak or what? You know what I mean? How do they manage this forward so that it's not a man, we were really awesome for that one year? And then we kind of lost our way?
Brooke Chapman 28:59
Yeah, great question. We recommend that businesses should be reviewing their position every two to three years. Because, you know, markets aren't static customers change behaviors change. Look what's happened with the pandemic, most buying behaviors have changed in some way during that time. So, you know, it depends what's going on in your market and how rapidly it's changing. But every two to three years, you should be looking at your market position and checking that things are still on track. A lot of the time as well, you should have a marketing strategy update every year. And your performance will dictate that as well. You'll start to see, you know that maybe some channels that you were engaged in that worked really well initially aren't working so well anymore, they might have hit maturity, you need to freshen things up with a new message or you need to add another channel in the mix or just reevaluate. So the answer is Michele, that you're evaluating every year you're looking at what worked and what didn't and then you're pivoting accordingly and you're trying new things. So that's where the help of a strategist can really help you to focus where you try new things and help you around where you improve as opposed to just kind of picking things out of thin air. So it's usually a bit of a better recipe.
Michele 30:03
Now we've heard of it, I forget, what did you call it at the beginning when you said, it's not if they're not using strategy, their tactics we'll call random acts of marketing, random acts of marketing, that makes me laugh. We always, of course, call it like, we stuck, we throw spaghetti at the wall to see what would stick or like slamming jello against the wall, right? It's that scattered, that very scattered approach. I usually tell them, it feels like an octopus like grabby, right, you're just grabbing it the next thing that's in front of you. So as we're thinking about those two books, are there any, like one or two metrics that that come to top of mind that people can maybe look at? Is it you know, and maybe it's per channel? Is it engagement? Is it likes? Is it comments, is it because even that has changed over time it used to be, there was no, no impressions at the beginning. And now like, you know, every channel, if we're thinking social media, for sure. It's constantly changing, it is always changing. And what worked at one point doesn't work again. But are there any metrics across anything that you think that people could start to just be like, Why don't I even just go take a look at that?
Brooke Chapman 31:19
Yeah, sure that the number one thing that I would encourage people to do is to set up and net promoter score, and NPS score. So customer satisfaction score, after you do a job, or you deliver a service, you should always be sending out a NPS survey and getting a rating. So you know, there's lots of free platforms out there, it's a really simple thing to set up. But you need to keep a gauge on that satisfaction. And that's really critical in terms of your marketing metrics. There's a whole heap of metrics out there, that kind of mean nothing, and a lot of them in the digital space. When we talk about impressions and engagements and click throughs. Every channel needs to have metrics and KPIs. But I wouldn't say that the ones that your digital agency are serving up to you are necessarily the right ones, you really need to figure out what are the drivers of your business. So there's obviously the commercial returns around the amount of sales you make every month, you know, the revenue you bring in the new leads that come in the conversion of those leads, you need to think about, you know, what are the hallmarks of success in your business? What does your business need to continue surviving and to make a profit, and then you need to go back from there. And you need to see how each channel you're engaged in can contribute to that. But be very aware about things like impressions and likes, you need to know how that actually translates into dollars. And that is an analysis that you should be doing with a marketing strategist to really decode that and make sure you've got the right metrics in your business. Yeah,
Michele 32:41
I've definitely seen the difference in that over the years and what it was in, I don't know what 2013 When I started this journey is not what it looks like in 2023. So very different. I think that's what's so interesting about strategy versus tactics. With everything shifting and changing. If we don't have the view of the overall strategy, we can sometimes get twisted up with those tactics, right, then we're either like you said, we're spending money where we shouldn't. I know, I've had some channels that I pulled back on, because it they meant nothing to me, like I was, we did everything we could and they just it they were not a channel that my people went to to find me, they never looked for me there. And so we just didn't even make sense to be there anymore. Right? It was, it was wasted dollars, that we can move to another channel, where my people were hanging out. It's kind of like saying I used to I use this analogy all the time, I used to say it's like fishing for freshwater fish, but throwing your bait into the ocean, you're not going to get freshwater fish. So if you if you're thinking about it that way you want to go fishing, where the middle that you're trying to get is going to be served. That's just where you're going to go. I'm not going to go to a Chinese restaurant and order a pizza like doesn't make any sense.
Brooke Chapman 34:00
Yeah, you've got to, you've got to be really picky with that. And we've seen a lot in in 2022, we saw a lot of big businesses making serious changes to their channel strategy. Airbnb was one of them. So Airbnb used to invest a lot of money in search huge millions of dollars in Google Search. And they really pulled back from that. And what they found was that it actually didn't impact their bottom line. So they stopped doing it. And they did that. But they've got into this habit of it was what they've always done. So they just kept investing. And when they really tested it, they realized that it wasn't the right channel. They didn't, they're still investing somewhat, but nowhere near the level that they were. So you've got to be really choosy because you can get into a situation where you're on a bit of a hamster wheel and you're just putting good money after bad and it's actually not delivering for the business.
Michele 34:49
I love it. So if someone were to hear this today and think, Okay, I want to I want to talk to Brooke and her team. I want to speak to somebody to see what what it might look like for me, how do they get in touch with you?
Brooke Chapman 35:02
They can go to our website, so threeby3.com. And we can offer your listeners a special promotion that we've got going today, we have an online benchmarking. It's a 10-minute survey you can take and it will give you a bit of a understanding as to how you're performing in your current marketing across the nine boxes of sales and marketing that we've identified in our framework. So you can take the temperature as to how you're going, you can go on to the website, request that we send you a link to the benchmark, we'll get that done. And then really happy to jump on a call with you and tell you what your scores mean. So that's free for any of your listeners that would like to take that up today.
Michele 35:41
That's awesome. Thank you so much. And I will make sure that I have all of the links for everybody to find you in the show notes. And just thank you so much for being on today.
Brooke Chapman 35:49
Thanks, Michele. It was a really good conversation. Thank you for it.
Michele 35:52
Thank you.
Michele 35:53
Brooke, thank you so much for joining us today. It was such a fun conversation. I really loved hearing your accent too. So that was a bonus. And I hope that those that are listening, understand the difference now between having a strategy and working just in tactics, I know that I'm gonna go back and take a look at my business. I did it about a year and a half ago. So it's probably time on that two to three year timeline. And I would recommend that you could do that too. And then feel free to send me any comments if there's anything that you found, or anything that's new to you. Also, if you need help building a strong foundation, and a strategic plan for your overall business, I would love to be able to help you feel free to go to scarletthreadconsulting.com and fill out a discovery form and let's talk and you can also check out the case studies and information from my clients that have already been through the process. All of that is out there. So take advantage of all the free downloads and get the help that you need. Let someone help you. I know that I always need help in my business and I'm sure you do too. And asking for help is profitable and profit doesn't happen by accident. Profit is a Choice is proud to be part of the designnetwork.org where you can discover more design media reaching creative listeners. Thanks for listening and stay creative and business minded.