286: Profitability of Working with a Family Member     

Michele: Hello, my name is Michele and you're listening to Profit is a Choice.

On today’s episode, we’re joined by Beth Meyer and Abby McLane of Beth Meyer Design, a mother-daughter team specializing in luxury residential interiors. Featured in Southern Home and LUXE, they’ve built a trusted brand through elegant design and smart business growth. We’ll explore how they started working together, their approach to profitability, and the benefits of running a family-based interior design business. If you're looking for real strategies to grow your design firm, this one’s for you.

Every day, empowered entrepreneurs are taking ownership of their company, financial health and enjoying the rewards of reduced stress and more creativity. With my background as a financial software developer, owner of multiple businesses in the interior design industry, educator, and speaker, I coach women in the interior design industry to increase their profits, regain ownership of their bottom line, and to have fun again in their business. Welcome to Profit is a Choice.

Hey Beth. Hey Abby. Welcome to the podcast.

Beth: Hello, we're glad to be here.

Michele: I'm excited to have you both. It's not often that I get to interview teams at the same time and certainly not mother-daughter teams. I think I’ve only had maybe one other mother-daughter team. I’ve had a couple of husband-wife teams. So, this is fun for me.

Beth: It’s fun for us too.

Michele: Good! So, we're going to have a great time. I want to jump in though before we get too far down to the path that you two are currently on. Beth, I'd love to start with you. Since you started this business, oh goodness, years ago as a solopreneur, as a one-person design team; you, you, and you. And then you started bringing in some help. But tell us a little bit about your journey of starting your design firm by yourself.

Beth: Well, I graduated from Auburn University in 1989 in their interiors program and went right to work after an internship for a model home merchandising interior design firm. We did model home sales centers and clubhouses for developers throughout the southeast. So, I worked in that industry for a couple of years, and it was fun, but it was time for a little change of direction for me. And so, in ‘93 I went out on my own and fortunately, I had some smaller projects for friends and friends’ parents. And then, fortunately, I had one project that was a large-scale new construction, more of a luxury build than full furnishings. That project really set me off. It really did catapult me. I think it gave a lot of credibility for the type of work that I was capable of doing. And so that really started taking off in ‘93 and kind of got my foot in the door, and from there, you know, it just grew. But that's how it started, very grateful for that one nugget.

Michele: Right. I was gonna say, isn't it interesting a lot of the designers that I talked to, many of them have a similar story of kind of a slower burn. You know, they're getting started, they're getting their feet wet. They're trying to figure out this whole business thing by themselves. There's a lot that goes on when you start your firm. You've got to do the work, but you've got to figure out how to manage the sales and the marketing and the finances and all the stuff, the HR, even if it's only you, we’ve got to figure out how to handle all the pieces and parts. But so many people say there was this one project that shifted me to the next level. And then as they go along, there's that one next project that shifts them up again. It's as if you can almost recognize that shift. I used to teach it in a way that there were concentric circles that all went in smaller and that the outside ranges maybe we're going to do one room for you, and then we come in and it's like we're going to do three rooms for you, and then we're going to do one level for you, and then we want the whole house. It is rare that most people hang their shingles and go to the center of all the circles. They don't have the skills in most cases unless they have a longer career where they've actually done more. And even in a long career, most people don't take it from beginning to end. And somebody else's firm, there are other people helping do that. So, it's just not normally the first step. You usually work your way in, and there's that one big project that moves you into the next concentric circle that gets to the point that you want to get. Do you stay in touch with that particular client?

Beth: Oh, yes. Well, actually, one has passed away. They were older, but, you know, they were my parent's age actually even a little older than my parents. But it was so funny because I did come back, like, maybe 10 or 12 years later and freshened up, and everything was exactly how I left it, and she would even photograph her bookshelves so that the accessories after the cleaning lady had been there it was exactly how. I joke and say, Ann, you really haven't changed anything. A lot of times people layer things in. She kept it just so. But they were sweet, and they had a beach condo. It is just like you said, it just kind of continued to grow and then I worked for their children in their homes. And so, it was definitely a blessing for sure to start.

Michele: It's funny, back in ‘93, the age of our parents probably wouldn't be much off than our age today.

Beth: Exactly.

Michele: Just doing some mental math while you said that given that I graduated college in ‘89. I happen to know about how old you are.

Beth: Yeah, exactly. We're on the same. We're on the same playing field.

Michele: Yeah. We're at the same place. So, when did you start hiring people? Even like contractors are part-time people to help you, Beth. I know this is a lot for anybody to do all by themselves and usually people start at least hiring some admin help or office help, you know, certainly bookkeeping assistance or even a part-time junior designer or something. When did you start reaching out for people to help you in the business?

Beth: Well, one of the first hires was a good friend of mine that I just really needed another set of hands and wheels. And back then, Michele, we had to go everywhere. We didn't have a computer or online, so we had to go pick up the samples or go to the showroom and see what our options were. You really had a lot of gopher work. And so, I had one friend that helped me for a number of years and then actually my sister-in-law helped me for a long time. She was from a fashion merchandising background, so she did have a really good sense of color and she was a go-getter and a hustler and we had a lot of fun installing jobs. But those were my first type of support, just another set of hands and another car to get to where we needed to go and make things happen.

Michele: I'll say this really quick. So, I started my window treatment business in 2000, and I still laugh when you're talking about how manual it all was. I remember a couple of things that just brought a big smile when you said that. I remember sitting at Burns and Noble reading books on how to do what I needed to go and do because there was no online education for any of those things and I couldn't even find lessons that taught me how to do advanced skills for window coverings. Like all these things. And I don't know if you probably did this. I know one of the designers that I worked with at the time was still doing this in the early 2000s, but we were buying every “House Beautiful”, every “Veranda”, every magazine known to man if there was anything beautiful or inspirational that we liked, and we wanted to buy, sell duplicate in any fashion or form, cut the page out and we put it into a clear page protector, and then put them all in a notebook and then tried to arrange them to make our own lookbooks the way that we now would use Pinterest or the way that now we would use an inspiration board.

Abby: I don’t know anything about that

Michele: It’s like everything behind Abby; we had all that cut out and stuck into a piece.

Abby: But I actually think it's funny that you say that because in maybe elementary school I did the same thing, believe it or not. I don't think Pinterest was around yet, but I had a binder, and I guess I learned that from you.

Beth: She started early.

Abby: I always loved magazines, and I had them in little clear files. So that's funny.

Michele: Yeah, the little clear folders that had the little three-ring punch and you'd put them in there and I actually just threw some away in the last year. I didn't realize they were still on my shelf taking up space and I pulled out and I was like, oh my gosh. And then if I went anywhere and saw a window treatment or saw anything, I was constantly taking pictures and dropping them into those folders for more and more and more inspiration as we traveled. So it is just funny when you say manual, I remember the very manual amount of work that went into doing anything visually. That's what people always would go into the model homes, and they would say, just give me that, because that's all they had seen. We didn't have the breadth unless you traveled, you did not have the breadth of inspiration that we now have with, you know, the Internet and the ability to see outside of where we live and what we do.

Beth: Right. Yep.

Michele: So, you worked with, with part-time help back and forth for years. I know you and I met, and I want to say it was in ‘22 maybe? Somewhere around there and at that point you had a small team that I think most were still part-time supporting you.

Beth: They were all part-time. Yeah, we had, I had another friend who did just another set of hands as well in running. And then I did have a part-time bookkeeper and then I hired another lady that did the ordering, additional ordering, and tracking, and getting us ready for installs, but all part-time help. And really none of them were, well I didn't have a junior designer, so to speak. I didn't have somebody who really had a strong skill set or a trained interior designer. And I think that I had maybe just hired somebody when you and I connected. But that was the first time that I had somebody who graduated from interior design school and was very trained in that, or not very trained, but education was right.

Michele: They had the background.

Beth: They had a degree.

Michele: Right. So, I'm curious, before we move in, we're going to tell Abby's entry into our story or into your story and then our story together. I'm curious. Beth, at the time that you called me, that was your team. And I know that we have other friends that I've worked with as well. I'm curious though, what was happening in your business, your life, that made you go, okay, I've been doing this a long time. Because you've been doing this for, gosh, 30 years at that point, you know, 29, 30 years. It wasn't that you didn't have a lot behind you. You did, you had success, and you had teams that were helping you. What was it that made you realize you wanted or needed more or different than what you had?

Beth: Well, I would say just how we were talking about concentric circles and growth, but I, you know, over 30 years my business has really grown and the level of projects and the investment amount in our projects have really grown, and that's a wonderful blessing. But it was a bit chaotic and really, quite honestly, I was burning the candles at both ends. I was working like a dog, and I had great revenue, but I had no idea how much money was actually mine or what I was making. I was just surviving, and we had no systems, procedures, or processes really in place. I was just flying by the seat of my pants, and I really had reached a point of frankly becoming. I was on the track of being full-on burnout. But I do remember talking to my good friend Lori and saying, I just don't know if I can keep doing this or if I want to. I mean, I don't want to feel this way and go down this path of being uncontrolled and being burned out. And so, I knew what I needed, I thought I knew what I needed, but Lori said, you have got to call my friend Michele, and I was just like, I'll do anything.

Michele: Well, did Lori tell you, how she and I met?

Beth: Yes, she was on this. She said that she had the same thing. She was on burnout. She's like, I just don't know that I want to do this anymore.

Michele: We met at one point. It was in May; it was in May of 2013. I mean, I remember it that clearly. She had an orange trench coat standing in the den of my friend Lindsay’s home. And she was like; I'm so burned out; I don't know that I can do this anymore. And I said, well, why don't you give me three months through the summer? Either I'll help you turn it around, or you can decide to close, and I'll help you close it. And she said, all right, I can give it three months to try to get help to pull it together. And she's still here today and doing a beautiful job. That's why I think it's so interesting that you said you went to her voicing the same thing that she had voiced to me. I just remember standing there looking at her and looking at how successful she was and understanding that level of burnout, and I recognized it because I'd come from burnout. That was the whole reason I started the coaching practice as having come from burnout myself. When I get those calls, my heart feels for that, because I've been there, and I know what that feels like. The exhaustion and the mental load and the emotional turmoil, it's real and it's heavy. And I'm so glad that she sent you here. I'm glad that you felt like you could voice that to her, though. I think sometimes we just keep going, especially as women. I'm not saying men don't do it, but especially as women in business, we are so busy trying to be the caretakers. We're so busy trying to keep our families going. You had young children at the time, you know, or younger children. You guys were, I think, early college or just getting out of college. And there was just a lot going on and all of that, a husband and all kinds of things, household. We're constantly thinking, it's going to turn, it's going to turn, it's going to turn until we say to ourselves, I don't know if this is really going to turn. The thought of that is like, it'll shut you down.

Beth: It will. When you're waking up in the middle of the night, you know, writing things down so you won't forget or think.

Abby: You can't sleep at all.

Beth: Or can't sleep at all. You know, I'm forever grateful to Lori for that and forever grateful to you because it has been a game changer, a total game changer. And so, anyway, that's how I connected with you. And then we still have a lot more for that.

Michele: But that's important because I want people to understand as part of your journey, you guys didn't just come into this together immediately. You had a long 30-year journey before Abby comes in, who's been pulling out pictures and putting them in her lookbook from a little girl. Let’s talk about this. The next question I want to ask is, Abby, tell us a little bit about your journey. Because you didn't come directly out of school and start to work with your mom, your mother encouraged you to go out and do your thing before you guys ever came together. Tell us about your journey in design.

Abby: So, backing way up. I grew up always interested in what my mom did. And she would tote me around to work, sometimes I went to Scott Antique Market and ADAC. And for me, it was always exciting to go. It was never like she was dragging me along. So, from day one, I was playing with fabric samples and, you know, tearing out magazine pictures and all the things. I went to Georgia, and I did an internship. I worked a little bit with you over some summers during high school. I did an internship, I believe, after my sophomore year before I started in the design program. She just wanted me to see all aspects, the not-so-glamorous, and make sure this was what you wanted to do, and I still loved it.

Beth: So, she worked for a couple of showrooms at ADAC during her college years.

Abby: Yes. Which was a great experience. I graduated from Georgia. We had our internship this summer before our senior year. And then, I worked for a great designer who I still love and interned for her throughout my senior year. Then I worked for a handful of other reputable great designers, and I learned so much from each of them. I think even, you know, back to the high school days when we were kind of thinking about my career path and wanting to go into this, she had always said, and I felt the same way, that you need to go work for some other people and don't graduate and just come work for me. I think that was a really good move because I was able to learn so much from some other people that maybe I wouldn't have learned directly from you. Then when I did come on, and work for her, I was able to bring some knowledge to the table. And it was a good move, good advice.

Michele: I love that. Because you know what? We don't always learn the same way from our parents. And the way the relationship between the parent and a child can be very different. And so, I know that when my kids come in now who are grown men, Abby's age and older, they come in and talk to me about something that they have experienced outside of what they've learned in our home, I listen to it very differently than I would if it's something that I taught in my home. Not only that, but I’m also sure that every business I've worked with has had something to learn and somewhere to grow. We all have areas of growth. And so, Abby, for you to work with so many different designers and showrooms, my guess is you were able to look and see things that you might think, I want to do that if I ever have a business. I don't want to do that if I ever do. I have people say to me all the time, I've never worked for another designer, so I don't even know what it looks like out there. I've never looked, I've never worked, and I've never seen. And so, you have that experience. I'm sure that when you came in, I know some of the designers that you've worked for and really great designers, and when you came in to work with your mom and you brought knowledge from multiple places, just, what if we were to organize this way? Or what if we were to do that? Beth, back to you for a minute. You know, the fact that everything was so manual back in the day, and at our age, it has been hard. I mean, it just has. I usually tell people, and no offense here, if somebody's 45 and older unless they have stayed with it, tech has moved past what they feel like they can jump in and do, and it's overwhelming. We didn't grow up with it. We didn't have cell phones. We had Atari. I mean, come on, people. We didn't have all that. I remember when we got our first VCR, and I got one before everybody else on the street, and we had like three movies we could watch. But we just didn't grow up with tech, you know, we grew up with the tinfoil on the antennas, trying to get the TV to come. Not kidding. And trying to stop the snow. So, it's just, it's such a different thing for us. And we have this idea that we're going to screw it all up and mess it up. And so, we are a bit more hesitant as an age group to just jump in and tackle it. Not saying this is for every person, but I'm saying by and large, at 45 and older, that's what you see. So, we have to learn it to stay in business today. And I still know some designers that do almost every single thing by hand. Somebody the other day told me they were afraid of a Google sheet. They were afraid. But I was going to say for you to, you know, have realized some of the chaos, even back when you and I first met, was that embrace of all of the technology coming from a more manual system and manual ways of doing things and processes change over time. You know, the way we buy changes over time, all the things happen that are just different. And so, for you to have had to be more self-taught through some of that because you were working for yourself at the time. Abby, to have been kind of shot out of school, learning it, knowing it, having grown up with cell phones, at least by middle school, I think my kids were in middle school with phones. I remember when texting first came out and my son didn't realize we were paying for Text. Sitting on the box at the corner of our yard with the little girl next door, and they texted each other while they were beside each other, and we got a $300 bill. Yeah, we stopped that one very fast. But he, they had cell phones from a smaller age than we did. Right. So, Abby, you, going to work for all these other companies coming out of college with it, you probably even brought just this embracing of tech, I can guess, into the company that then your mom was like, okay, wait, like, teach me Google sheets. Is that something that we need? There's a different layer of organization that came in, I bet.

Abby: Yes, definitely. I think each of the firms I worked for was not only so different from our firm and the way it was when I started and the way it is now, but from each other, which was a great experience. There were a lot of, I mean, just technology programs that I kept saying from the day I joined, we need to get on this, and it took till this past year that we're like, okay, we actually really do need to get on this and made the jump.

Beth: I can only take so many technology additions at a time.

Michele: At a time, at a time. Well, let's back up one. One little step before we hop forward again. How did you two decide to go ahead and merge and to work together, to have Abby come in because you've been working with other designers, and were happy? But what was it that made you decide, okay, maybe we do need to bring this together?

Beth: Well, I had a wonderful young lady that helped me, for about a year, and she needed to make a change, and she had a lot of technology. She had brought some in, too. And so, I knew I had to start looking for somebody. And it is frustrating because there are a lot of young designers, not all of them, but they do want to go on their own eventually. So, you bring them in. It takes time to train, and then they're going to leave again. Not all are, but it's just a cycle. I was talking to Abby about it and seeing if she knew of anybody or whatever, and she just finally said, and that didn't actually take that long, she's like, Mom, this is what we've always wanted to do. Why not? Why not? Let's just go for it.

Abby: It made sense, really. Great timing for both of us.

Beth: That's how it fell into place. I'm like, if you're willing, I'm willing. I had been with you, too, for a while, so I felt like, financially, I had an understanding of where we were. You know, that takes time.

Michele: We had started putting a lot of structure in place to allow for a new hire, whether it was Abby or whoever we were planning for that hire in the structure that surrounded all that.

Beth: Right. Yeah. So, I felt confident that we got it on. As long as the business keeps coming in things were in place for her, because that is a responsibility. And then I'm the mother, too.

Michele: Right, right. You don't get a handout.

Beth: Yeah.

Michele: I love how God just allows the timing to be so perfect for both of you. You know, Beth, you being able to say, I'm burned out. Being able to talk to Lori, for us to be able to work together to get your business in place so that you felt confident bringing your daughter on, you know, because at that point, you're right, there is a different emotional layer of I got to keep work going, but I've got to keep work going for my daughter and her family and hopefully and you know, future grandchildren. Because at the time I don't think you had.

Beth: No. That, that one on the God throws you those curveballs.

Michele: That's right.

Beth: That was a beautiful curveball.

Michele: Beautiful curveballs. But just how His timing is so perfect in that journey for you guys. I love seeing that. So, Abby, when you came in did you say Mom, we need to sit down and talk about our positions? Did she talk about that? How did you guys negotiate at the beginning? How did each have your own area of focus or what you were going to do or how you were going to split the work? My guess is also that Beth trusted you a little differently than maybe she would somebody she didn't know because she knew your journey, she knew what you knew. She knew to some degree what you could do. I'm sure you still surprised her because she said you did. But how did you guys at least start that conversation of how is this going to work?

Abby: Yeah, I think from the beginning things just naturally our roles just kind of fell into place. I think, even now with all of our projects, we don't really split things up. We are a team and do everything together from the designing on. I do think I kind of took over more of the procurement, the ordering, the weeds kind of the organization. Organization of running the project. But I don't know if we really had to sit down like this is my job, these are my tasks. I think it, you know, at the time, we were the only designers. We had not hired anybody else yet. We just do everything together really.

Beth: I think too when she started, I think, I had work in progress, so she had to kind of come on in and see how we did it. And then as we went along, she could say, hey, let's put this in a spreadsheet this way because she was taking over the ordering and keeping track of all the work orders and Pos, and she was more in the weeds. That's another thing, I'm not in the weeds anymore, which I really love. But it just kind of naturally evolved that she could see where we could organize better. And then we did get into some others, you know, working with some coaching on processes and all of that too as well. But it just kind of naturally evolved and I appreciated and valued that she had a lot to come in with. So, if she said we can do this better this way...

Abby: Was going to just add to that that you were always. I think that was a blessing. And just the dynamic from the beginning, it was never her saying my way or the highway. This is how I've done it all this time. This is how we're going to do it. Even now, it was just always open to it that way works best, let's do it, you know. So, I think that made the transition easier too.

Michele: I think both of you have very easygoing personalities. You both have a kindness. I know we just spent, we'll talk about why you came back into coaching in a bit, but we just spent a full day together not too long ago, really, at the beginning of the year, going through your mission, your vision, your values, and the heartbeat of your company. And I know and you know that God is the center of what you're doing. I mean, you both have a heart for the Lord and a heart for each other and for the families that you serve and the people that you work with, and it's apparent in what you do and how you behave and how you present yourself, not just to the outside people, but to each other. And you know, working with a family member can be very difficult. There are some that will tell you not to work with a family member, and don't loan money to family members. Like, stay away from them as far as you can. Yet you guys have had a very different experience. And I believe a lot of it has to do with that. Your why is so, like, they're slightly different from a personal perspective, but together the why of the company is just so focused and you both can get behind that. It's evident that you keep that in front of you and all that you do even in the relationship and the communication that you have with each other.

Beth: Definitely, yeah.

Michele: What other benefits have you guys seen to working together?

Beth: Well, my goodness. I mean, we just have a ball. Love it.

Abby: We love what we do. I think we both say it's a dream come true. Like, not to be cheesy, but it's so much fun. I mean, of course, work is work. There are some days that are more fun than others, but in general, it's just, it's so fun. And I think you would say it's kind of giving you a renewed excitement and passion and definitely the same for me, I mean not that I've had 30 years’ experience of it, but just it's so fun. And we back to our dynamics blending well together. I think we were talking about this recently. Kind of laughed that as much as we're very family oriented with everyone, our family loved them all. But I don't know if anybody else could work together. I really do think that God just designed the way we're wired in our personalities to blend. I don't know, it's just been fun.

Beth: We have some strong personalities.

Michele: I've seen some that were not blended well and were not meshed well and for whatever reason they still wanted it. What's also been fun and following on your Instagram and things like that. Abby is seeing your little girl go to work with mommy on some days. The same way that Beth drug you around. You know, there will be a day when she'll say on a Friday do I get to go to Scott with you Mom? It's going to be fun, Beth. I know it's got to feel like full circle.

Abby: It does.

Beth: It is a full circle moment, you know. She had to take Peyton with her to ADAC.

Michele: It wasn't too long ago, during a weather day.

Abby: Yeah, during Christmas or something with her.

Beth: With her little goldfish.

Abby: It was a hot mess.

Beth: I did say it was hard.

Abby: But it's fun.

Michele: Yeah, it's fun. You'll have good pictures of that. On another note, what if you found to be a challenge to work together as a mother-daughter duo?

Abby: Well, speaking of my daughter, I think that she was a surprise. Amazing surprise. But it's just funny how God changed your plans. And I think, you know, she has always said this in life in general, it's like it's great to have your plans and be proactive and be wise and think ahead, but you also have to hold them somewhat loosely. And so, I always say keep your hands open because you have something different. We kind of had all these plans and then I found out I was pregnant. And that was an exciting little challenge there. But I think it was just good for us to work through, you know, just things going a little differently and she was able to fill in the gaps for me when I was out for a little while and just showing grace to me, trying to balance becoming a mom and working and not just working, but the business is growing and just balancing everything.

Beth: I wouldn't. And that's probably, you know, the biggest challenge that we had. It was just a pivot.

Abby: A pivot is a better word.

Beth: We weren't expecting this but would not turn it back at all. I think from a mother's standpoint, it's very important to me that when she's home, she’s with her family, and mom's not calling saying, hey, forgot to ask you, did you remember?

Abby: You know, and even though I say it never bothers me, and we will be texting at 10:30, on a Friday night, pictures of something we see.

Beth: With our other girls, I don't want to bother them after hours. I mean, unless they were. And they're also gracious. They, you know, if I had to, they would answer. But I just want to respect her time. And so, you know, my brain, just because it's always moving. Probably the challenge is to stop it for her in the evening, just respect for her time. You know what I mean?

Michele: I do. I do. Well, especially because even as your daughter, it's like, oh, I have the ability to share this with you. The boundaries are a little different. And so, it's right, because we can communicate at 10:30 as mother and son, my kids and mother and daughter. We can communicate at 10:30 on a Friday night. That's normal. But it's then trying to find the balance of where do we make it about personal things and not encroaching on work or doing too much. I have family members that work with me as well, and I try very hard to be very careful on how we do that outside of, work times and spaces and agreed upon times to communicate so that we can still be, you know, I hire my sister, I've hired my husband, I've hired one of my sons so that we can still carry on our relationship in the most healthy way possible and not let them cross over into any bad areas. Because sometimes the things we have to share or say are just difficult things, just like they would be in any work situation. You know, so and so is not happy or we forgot to get this done or oh, my gosh, we had a misspelling here. And it's not always somebody's fault. It's just that we have to work together to solve these things. And so, I can appreciate that. Let me ask you this. I know one of the things that you guys recently have done was reach back out to me, I guess, in the fall of ’24, and we decided to work together this year to kind of merge some of the ideas that you both have for the future and for a longer-term vision of where the company is going. So, kind of taking that, you had a good year and a half, two years probably of, the two of you coming together and finding your way of working together. You've hired another team. And so now what we're working on is how to move forward. What made you decide that the time was right to do that?

Beth: Well, you know, we had worked through a lot. We had done our financials, rebranding processes, and procedures. And, you know, the business is just growing and the level of projects, one of the things you helped me with was, I guess you would say niching down, instead of doing everything that came to me, we had moved towards, taking fewer, but they're all large scale projects and they’re all large investment projects. With that, there's just some opportunity to keep growing in that market. And then we are opening a warehouse, our own warehouse now to receive everything and hold some stock. We were kind of thinking about that, and you invited us to the workshop, and you had talked to me about strategic planning before, but I could only take one nugget at a time, which is strategic planning Q1, Q2. But I can only take on so much. But I know that, because we've laughed about it, but we went to the workshop and I always said, well, I just thought strategic planning is just writing down some goals. Then I realized we didn't really know what. We really didn't know what a strategic plan was. And so, after the workshop, we were like, oh my gosh, we need to dive into this now, and that was the impetus of it all and just really digging deeper and how to bite those nuggets off in certain time periods and then really getting down.

Michele: Isn't it freeing?

Beth: It is, it is.

Michele: I still think of the back and forth that I had with you when we were talking about it, and I was like, strategic planning. And you said I've got a strategic plan. I'm like, send it to me, and you're like here are three bullet points. I wrote back; this is not a strategic plan.

Beth: This is what you're just thinking.

Michele: Yeah, well, you know, you know what's so interesting, Beth, but it is so funny because I can't tell you the number of people that call me that start, and they really just want to talk about financials. Financials, Financials, financials. Money, money. And I'm like, I'm all fine with that. And I'll say, but what is your strategic plan? And they're like, I don't have one. And I'm like, well, the problem here is I can never help your financials match where you're trying to go if we don't identify where you're going, I can't do it. I can't create a budget for your trip across the country if we don't know where you're stopping and getting off.

Beth: Right.

Abby: Right.

Michele: Aby, you look like you were going to say something.

Abby: I was just going to say, another part of why we wanted to do coaching again this year is our projects had grown. We also hired two new girls. And so that was also a big component in that we now have a team. and so just learning how to manage all of that and be a good boss.

Beth: Just be good leaders. Be good leaders. And you know too, over time and all these opportunities, it's also given us even a little more of just a direction of where we want to go. If you want to do those things, you do have to be successful in that, I mean there are lots of goals within the strategic plan, but to be successful where we want our business to be, we need to be a well-oiled machine. And that has been super interesting to dig into, and I'm not going to work forever. I want to work for a long time. But I will be stepping back at some point now. I may still have one foot in and one foot out, I don't know. But she loves the business, and so doing this exercise and keeping it going, and it really makes me feel confident that when I step out, she's got a great business and she's invested in it. She's really invested in the time and working on her SOPs. We're seeing the value of that. We had a discussion this morning that we need to fine-tune this. I see a weak link here that we need to just fine-tune to alleviate training and retraining. And there are many levels to why we wanted to dive into that. But in the end, I just feel like when I step back, she's got a well-oiled machine. It's fluid. You’re always going to edit, but I feel like I won't have to be here to run a business. She will have it all set in place.

Michele: And let's be honest, you don't want her to be in the same place you were when you called me the first time. Right. The whole goal is not to be in that place because you recognize what that did to you, to your family, and to the others around you. And honestly, I think some of the things that get us in that mode, speaking for myself here, is not having a good prioritization model because everything then feels like a fire. And then if I've not done things that are significant, which are SOPs if you think about it, they're usually not urgent and they're important, but they're not urgent. They're not on fire. They're one of those things that you've got to stop something else to do. So, to me, they're significant. They're significant because if we put our time into getting things right and the structure right, then down the line it's going to be easier, but it means we have got to block time and we allow everything else to absorb our time and we don't do what's most significant that's going to save us later.

Beth: Right.

Michele: Put that process in place. Yeah. And so, it's being able to then recognize how we do that so that we don't go into burnout. One of the things that I really loved about the day with the two of you was talking about even as we talked about kind of that cycle of young men and women coming in and then maybe moving on and starting their own business, whatever it is they're doing is the same family culture that you two have. You're trying to build a culture in your company that allows other people to have families and to love the work that they do. I was chatting with the designer the other day and just talking about Beth, you remember back in the day, I mean, all the way back when I was in the working environment, in corporate, there was no part-time there. We had one or two people that did what they called a shared job. And one would work Monday, Tuesday, and half of Wednesday. The other would come in the rest of Wednesday and Thursday, Friday. That was as close to anything as we could get. And most of them wouldn't do it. So, women were either in or you were out. You were in the workplace, or you were out of the workplace, there was no middle ground. There was none of the things that we have today. And I'm seeing a lot more push for women who are saying, I'm willing to work four days a week, give me one day that I can run the errands, go to the doctor's appointments, and have with my kids. And I'm seeing businesses, especially smaller businesses that have the capability of doing that, either running four 10s or being off half a day on Fridays, or finding some flex in the work-life balance so that people can actually raise their children, be involved in their lives, going to, I don't know what muffins with mom or all like could think of was donuts with dad, but so that they could go to whatever it is that they need to go to and still be able to be fulfilled and work. I know that is also part of what you're trying to build. Something that does keep family at the top and is very important.

Beth: We really have a great team, really just a great team right now. I love mentoring too. I really love being in this seat and teaching again. You know, teaching these young designers who are just coming out really the process, because they don't know. In college, you get the basics and the technology, but, you know, once you get into it and you're on the job, you learn more than all of your college years. But I really enjoy that. And I went back to the strategic plan where we are in structuring the company and roles and SOPs. Well, it kind of layers that to not exasperate to your employees. You're giving them the tools they need to do their job well. You're not just giving them expectations that they really can’t meet. They have nothing like, where do I start? I feel that it’s being a good steward of their time with me and teaching the way we do things. I want them to enjoy what they're doing. I want them to enjoy coming to work. And so, and those are nuggets in our strategic plan that back when you asked me what a strategic plan was, I wasn't thinking that. But we're seeing the results of taking that time, and in the end, it's really good for our business as a structure, but also, it's really for them. If they move on, I want them to say that their time at Beth Meyer Design was an enjoyable, great learning experience and that Beth and Abby were great leaders.

Michele: You want them to feel as favorable about the places they work as Abby does about the places she's worked.

Beth: Yes, exactly. Exactly. But the strategic plan, oddly enough, is equipping us to do that.

Michele: Here's what's so important, and I want people to understand because you're saying it beautifully. It's identifying what it is you want to do and then creating time to do it. And the only way to create time to do it is to have a radical focus. In other words, we can't focus on 45 things. That's squirrel, squirrel, squirrel, squirrel. We have to have a radical focus. A focus that says this is kind of what we're going to do, and we're going to ruthlessly prioritize these things to get them done because they're going to move the needle. They're going to move the needle. They’re going to move the needle. I still giggle with your comment of yeah, we've got it all together, and you sent me three bullet points. And then I love that after our day together, you wrote back and said, “I had no idea”. I did not even know that that could be like that. I mean, it was a really fun day for me too.

Beth: It was a great fun day. By the end, we were kind of like driving home with no music. It was quiet but, like, it was really, really good. And, I think we have some really good plans. And she's such a plotter and a planner. I am too, but she's like next level.

Michele: Abby got excited about all the trackers.

Abby: I feel like a nerd.

Beth: I like it! It was fun, you know, it definitely was. It was a great experience. It just got the wheels turning. But for her, I felt like a lot of things were ones that I was just giving to her to figure out because she was like, we need to do this and that. I'm like, okay, figure it out, and let me know.

Michele: Yeah, right.

Beth: Go. And, you know, she started to be like, I don't know if I'm going to get to this, but, you know, another thing with the strategic plan is we're in Q1 right now, and we have our focus for this month. We don't need to worry. We've talked about it, and we are solely focused on these things for this quarter.

Michele: That's right, and then next month, next quarter, we'll focus on these.

Beth: I have clients that ask me that will. They'll come to this project. Like, oh my gosh, I don't know how we're going to do this. I'm like, hey, we eat an elephant one bite at a time.

Michele: That's right. You know, it is. So let me ask you this as we wrap up our time together. You know, the podcast is Profit is a Choice, and we talk about profit in more than just money, with profit, being like communication, like all kinds of things that help enhance the company that lead to profitability. What would you say has created the profitability in working together?

Beth: We kind of talked about this a little bit.

Abby: Yeah. I think the first thing that comes to my mind is our goals are the same and we have done a deep dive into our missions, our values, and all the things. When we are both pushing each other, it's built-in accountability to reach those goals. And as you said, I mean, of course, it is the money side of profitability, but it's the work-life balance. It's me being able to raise Peyton the way I want like the way she was able to raise me. It’s us leading our girls well, and having a great work environment. I think that our vision and our goals are so clear that it helps eliminate things that don't meet those goals. If that makes sense.

Michele: Yeah.

Beth: You can weed out. What I was kind of thinking on a different level, what Abby found in her strength finder was that she's an achiever and she gets a lot of satisfaction out of meeting a goal or whatever. So that fills your cup. My cup is very relational. I'm very relational. I love that the relationships are all good and positive and even with the girls, the whole team, you know, it's just, if you would say profitable, it just fills my cup in the business, you know. Yeah, that is enjoyable. And then that trickles on down to, the projects in our clients. You know, if, if we are, if we have our systems in place in our processes and just the whole of the business is organized and functioning well. That also makens the clients feel very comfortable. It's a good relationship. It's just, it's multi-layered, if you will. I hope that answers your question.

Michele: No, it does. I was even just thinking too of the profit. It profits you, and I loved what you both said, so this isn't in place of but I love how it profits you. Abby kind of hit on the fact that you have the same goals. And so sometimes when we have hires, we're constantly wondering are they pulling in the same direction? Do. Are they going to walk away? And when you guys stay on the same path, pushing in the same direction, there is a. You've got my back.

Beth: Yes. Oh yes.

Michele: Profit to the other person.

Beth: Right.

Michele: That bonus that the other person. Where your other employees may very well have your back. There is something about your daughter or your mom in the business having your back in a different way that gives you the courage to continually push forward. So not only does iron sharpen iron to keep each other accountable and focused and better and growing and all the things, but there is something about the courage that one person lends to another person to move forward. I know with my husband, my children, my sister, my parents, and my best friends, something about their belief in me helps me move forward. Something about my belief in them helps them move forward. And for you guys to have that kind of back and forth in the workplace, I think it definitely allows you both to say "Yeah, of course we could do that, sure, I'll help you get that done. Wow. That's going to be a stretch for us. But we can do it.” Like there's that push.

Beth: We do say that and that kind of circles back to your question about a family member and working with a family member. It's just a very trusting relationship. And I do know I have her with me to go forward and she has me, and I trust her.

Abby: I trust hers. It's good.

Beth: Yeah.

Abby: And we balance each other out well too.

Beth: I once had a pastor say about husband and wife relationship that you're like a jigsaw puzzle and where one is strong, the other is weak and you fit together, and I feel like that is us here. We definitely have different strengths and weaknesses but when you put us together, it's just a rock-solid bond and team and I'm very proud of her. Like wow.

Michele: I love it.

Beth: I can't believe this one is mine. I got two other great ones too.

Michele: I’m sure she is very proud of you too. And you're right, you do other amazing children. You know something that I'll point out before we close. I've worked with a couple of partnerships lately where they never really did the work up-front to determine one person's mission vision, one part the other's mission vision and kind of merging them. That jigsaw puzzle that you talk about and so you know for anybody listening out there, you guys came to me not long after you kind of came together and started recognizing it. But the more that you can understand the strengths and the weaknesses of each other and instead of pounding on their weaknesses, support their strengths, the more that you can understand that you immediately start to see why she checks things off, why she needs order because achiever, she needs it to fill her bucket. And you care about your teammate even if it's a partner and not a daughter or a spouse, you care about them because you're in business with them. The goal is you want their cup to be filled so that they enjoy their work and vice versa. And then the more that each person understands their why, and we bring them together and merge it into a company why that supports both, then that's what makes you feel like you're pushing towards the same things. I think doing that work is just imperative to feeling like you both fit in and not like somebody's going to come along behind you and knock your feet out from under you where you don't see it.

Beth: You know, you told us, suggested the strength finders. I think I did that with you at the very beginning. And then we actually, the whole team has done it now and it's really interesting for the four designers on the team, we all put it out there so you could see. One is relationship-oriented and then the other one is more. She and Abby have the same skill sets, but I think it's really important for them to see because they're kind of a team, so they work well together and understand how they both operate and think. And I think that's super helpful.

Michele: Well, thank you both so much for sharing your journey. I am super excited to be part of your journey and to support you and I just love how you guys work together. It's aspirational for many so thank you for sharing.

Beth: Thank you, thank you, Michele. You have changed my life, my friend, and my design business, and I'm very grateful and my friend Lori for referring but we are excited for our future and we appreciate and value you. Thank you, so much.

Abby: Thank you for having us too.

Michele: You're so welcome. Well, where can people find out more about your work? Where are you hanging out on Instagram and Facebook and all the things?

Abby: On Instagram Beth Meyer Design and we have a website too with our portfolio and yeah, try to do a decent job on Instagram.

Beth: We're keeping up.

Michele: That might be Q3. We'll have all that in the show notes so everybody can check it out. And again, I thank you for your time today.

Beth: Thank you, Michele. We appreciate you.

Michele: Thank you, Beth and Abby, for your time. I hope that you enjoyed this conversation about business growth and working with family members. In our conversation, we talked about strategic planning and that's part of the work that we do here at Scarlett Thread Consulting. We would like to help you create an actionable, workable strategic plan that captures where you want to go in your business and then help you create a financial plan that aligns with that and supports it. You can learn more by going to Scarletthreadconsulting.com and if you want the profitability of a strategic plan, let us help. Don't forget, profit doesn't happen by accident.

Profit is a Choice is proud to be part of the designetwork.org where you can discover more design media reaching creative listeners. Thanks for listening and stay creative and business minded.