221: Niching in Your Design Business From the Start
Michele 00:00
Hello, my name is Michele, and you're listening to Profit is a Choice. Joining me on the podcast today is Kaitlin Brophy. And she is with Brooklyn Elm. And what I love about the conversation that we're about to have is that it's going to be focused on creating a niche company from the very beginning, using skill sets from a prior career, and also just building a business with intentionality. So I hope you enjoy the podcast.
Michele 00:36
Every day, empowered entrepreneurs are taking ownership of their company financial health, and enjoying the rewards of reduced stress and more creativity. With my background, as a financial software developer, owner of multiple businesses, and the interior design, industry, educator, and speaker, I coach women in the interior design industry to increase their profits, regain ownership of their bottom line, and to have fun again in their business. Welcome to Profit is a Choice.
Michele 01:12
Hey, Kaitlin, welcome to the podcast. I'm so excited to have you with us today.
Kaitlin Brophy 01:16
Oh, thanks so much, Michele. It's really nice to be here. And I'm a huge fan of the work you do. So it's great to be here. Thank you.
Michele 01:22
Awesome. Well, I was doing some looking around, I was actually looking at some of my followers and I was looking at different information. And I stumbled upon your website. And then I reached out and was like, I really want to talk to you. It it drew me in from a lot of different perspectives. I think I've mentioned a couple of bullet points to you before we came on camera. But what I would love Kaitlin, you have a varied background, but you didn't come directly into design, you had a more circuitous route, to get there. And I'd love to hear you share a little bit of what brought you to design and to start a business there. And then let's dig into the other details.
Kaitlin Brophy 02:07
Definitely. So yes, like so many designers that we listen to on podcasts and know, in our community, I came to design. As a second career, I was an attorney. And I was happy being an attorney. And then I ended up staying home full time with my young children and stayed home a little bit longer than I intended. But the whole time I was home, I knew it was going to be temporary. I was always thinking of my return, you know, trying to very much enjoy the moment home with my kids, which I had very much so but thinking about what I would do next. And design was something I've been a lifelong design enthusiast of. I remember still like picking out the paint colors in my room. In kindergarten, when we moved to a new house, I had a subscription to Martha Stewart Living Magazine in middle school. So design has been a big part of my life. I love helping family and friends and always have. So it seemed like a natural thing to think about. And my husband actually suggested well, if you don't return to law, would you ever do something in design, and I was like, I know what this is, you know, I didn't know how I'd make it happen. But my business broken down is an outdoor furniture and accessories business. We provide design services, but we focus exclusively on luxury outdoor furniture. And I had that idea, really in my brainstorming phase of what I was going to do when I wanted to open this business, I wanted to niche and be specific, not only because I thought it would set me apart in the design field, but also really because I needed it. I'm a mom to five young kids, wife, I'm active in my community. And those are things I enjoy very much being a part of. So I needed to be very specific and focused so that I can make it work and balance everything. And so slowly as I was brainstorming this different ideas, I was actually away on vacation in the Caribbean with my husband, celebrating our 10th anniversary and surviving the first year of twins, we had three kids, and then had surprise twins. So going from three to five. And after that first year, we were like we need a vacation. We were sitting there, you know this beautiful space and just kind of came to me like how much I was enjoying myself looking at this furniture just it was like eye candy. And I thought oh my gosh, wouldn't it be so cool to have resort inspired furniture back home or you know if you could do that and then I was like wait, that could be my idea that could be my business and this was in 2017. So this was a this has been a long time in coming in terms of just having an idea and then getting from that moment of the idea to where I am now.
Michele 04:45
I love that. I love it. One of the things I was going to ask you was what inspired you to focus primarily on outdoor living spaces like you niche down from the very beginning and it or at least it seems like that that was part of your idea, right? And what's so interesting is so many routes to get to niching down is, why don't I try 45 things? Or why don't I do a little bit of everything for all people and then decide what I love? Then you kind of were able to narrow it down quickly. Do you think that was due to the exhaustion of being a new mom and, and really feeling the relief in that moment, and then having the AHA or, or did outdoor spaces and, and that that feeling is it something that you have always had, as you've grown up, and it was another,
Kaitlin Brophy 05:37
it was both really. So being home with my kids full time, you know, as a primary caregiver full time, knowing it was temporary and kind of having this like phase of my life where I'm really being a mom and enjoying that. But you know, brainstorming in my you know, when I'm walking with a double stroller, I'm going to the park, on the playground, in my car, by myself, you know, in between carpools listening to, you know, podcasts of design, business oriented podcasts like yours. And some others, I'm a huge fan of, I learned from listening to a podcast that there is a real benefit and importance to niching in your business for setting yourself apart. So that was, in my mind. And then the reality of my life and having you know, when my twins were born, my oldest was six, she was six and a half, she was in kindergarten, and we had a six year old, a five year old, two year old, and then the twins. So you know, you can imagine those first few years, right, like it was, it was a lot, you know, physically and just physically demanding. And so my outlet was thinking about what I was going to do, you know, when I did go back to work, or when I was having my own business again, or started my business. So there was, there was this part of me that had done enough research just through listening to podcasts and reading some, you know, entrepreneurial books like traction and profit. First, that I felt like, this could be a great concept for me as a business to niche, but then just my life obligations, I felt like I could do this, I want to do one thing really well. And I felt like if I really narrowed my scope and my focus in the services I provided, then I maybe had a chance of being successful. And it's funny, like, I've always liked as I said, in my design enthusiasts, so yes, I was helping friends, it was helping family and helping carpet and lighting and tile and running around just helping people in my personal life. And I realized quickly like this is a lot to do and design, I have so much respect for diner designers who do offer full service design for the whole home because it is a bear, it is so much work and so many moving pieces and so much to keep track of. And I just felt like I wouldn't be able to serve my clients in that capacity or on the counters that of that my family, something was, again, something was really going to have to change, if that's what I wanted to do. And I wasn't willing to, you know, basically come to a full stop on being the primary caregiver. So my plan was a very intentional slow growth plan, like I had this idea. Because I've been thinking about what my company could be someday if I did go out on my own. But then it was like, Okay, so now I'm going to put this idea into action. And there's there was like, a lot of steps along the way.
Michele 08:23
I love the marriage of not just your own marriage, right, but the marriage of business and life together. And that was one of the things that we talked about, before we came on air is just, we all have different seasons of life. I remember, after 10 years in corporate coming home to raise my family, and starting, you know, how can I get involved in this design community, yet also be home with my kids, you know, in different times in different seasons. And so, when I started, I did a lot of my work nights and weekends, like after my husband came home. And after we had dinner and bath and bedtime, I would go to work on things that I could not do while the kids were around, because it usually involves sharp objects and sewing machine needles and things that you know, in fabrication, but I loved it, it gave me a creative outlet, it gave me a way to see the full dimensionality of who I was created to be. Not that mom or wife or any of those are not enough. But for me, it just wasn't a representation of all that I had to bring to the world, right. And I didn't need any one thing to take up all the space. I wanted to be able to be kind of a whole person in that I need to have some type of an outlet to express my creativity and my desires. But I also wanted to be that mom and I wanted to be wife and I wanted to be able to go pick them up at you know, preschool or do whatever I needed to do. And so how do I create a life that allows me to do that and to grow? And Kaitlin yours are still probably pretty young. Yes, the youngest. Now, there are six now. Yes, they're in first day. Okay. And so you even have more time now than you would have had right after when the first idea came to you, right?
Kaitlin Brophy 10:12
Yeah. So I had an eye, everything you just didn't really resonates with me. So that's exactly how I felt. And you know, I wasn't working late at night, at the time, I was really just home. And, you know, I stayed involved in the company, I left, I worked for an international adoption agency, actually, before I stayed home full time. And I helped set up programs wherever we, you know, whatever country where maybe opening a program and I worked specifically on several Asian countries, a special needs program. And so that was very intense work. And I really enjoyed it. And it was very fulfilling. But for a variety of reasons I decided to stay home. And then I did really want to be present and a part of the preschool pickup and drop off. And you know, everything else that goes into it. In fact, I stayed active with my agency doing volunteer work, taking on projects here and there. I got really involved in my children's preschool, I eventually was on the board of that preschool. So I was doing all these things to stay busy and kind of keep my foot in the door of who I was before I had kids. But you know, then slowly, the idea for the design business came and then I honed it. And like you said, like, it's fulfilling to be home with your kids and present and doing, you know that role? Well, but then as your you know, I kind of always thought, well, this, what am I going to do when they are all in school, though, you know, what's next, like, this isn't this is, you know, like seasons, this will be there'll be a new season coming. And I felt, I guess I project but I, I felt like well, while I'm still in this phase, it's nice to kind of think about what I will do. So that I've sort of laid a foundation and can jump right in and get going versus doing all that building. And starting, right that I kind of wanted, I just knew myself, I knew I'd want to be active once they were gone. So it's funny how things work, I had that idea, like I said, in 2017, for Brook and Elm to be, you know, have an outdoor business. And then we moved from Connecticut to Massachusetts, we bought a home that was a spec build, it had no carpet, no window treatments, no nothing. So we hired a small design firm to help me with the custom window treatments and the owner who came to work on our project, we just really hit it off. And we just started to really get to know each other and one thing led to another and I ended up going to work for them in a very part time capacity. But as a business development associate, essentially they didn't have this role. But you know, our conversations were such that she knew I loved design, she knew I wanted to get back working. But at the time, it didn't even seem conceivable. My twin, my oldest at the time was seven, seven year old six year old. Right, right rolled and one year old. So when she pitched when she mentioned, like, Would you ever you don't want to go back to work? And I said, Yes, definitely. And kind of talked about that. And then she said, Well, I could really use someone like you, I think and I was like, Oh my gosh, I would love to talk to you about that. And I didn't even know how it was all going to happen. But I just so sort of knew there was just feeling like I have to say yes to this, and I don't know what's going to happen. But it just got me and my family used to me working outside the home again, in a very manageable capacity, but doing something that I knew I could bring value to them, given my background, I knew I could go in and sort of analyze where their systems and processes, you know, could be improved or were lacking and needed to be built out from, you know, the get go from my program development work prior.
Michele 13:45
You know, that's so interesting. So my kids now are see, at the time this comes out, they're going to be like 25 and 27, almost 26 and 28. This year, one's married, one's getting married, in a few months and so they're grown. And when I started, they were two and four. So you know, we've really traversed a lot with them as they've grown. Because I think one of the things that was easy for me to translate into the businesses that I've created are those operations and procedures all the way back from building software. You know, it's methodical, there is a way to do there is a process there is a list of things to be thinking about or to consider and, and you had some operational and organizational work in your program where I'd love this because you were able to translate those skills for this other company, which then laid the groundwork for you to translate them into the company that you were going to launch as well. Right.
Kaitlin Brophy 14:41
Yes, exactly. And I think that's something I didn't really know it at the time what I was doing, but what I was using my transferable skill set, that's right. I went to law school, I practice law. I, you know, worked for this agency and you know, in those different roles I as you know, when you're working on a case or your closing a deal, there's so much due diligence that goes into, from the moment that someone has this idea to the moment of closing and you know, dotting all your eyes and checking, you know, crossing all your T's. And so that's something that I'm just, I've inherently, you know, just developed with my, not only my education, but my, my work experience. And so I felt like, okay, where I'm lacking in design, true design training, what I can bring to this small business, meeting interior details at the time was, I can help work on your business, so you can be good, because you're so busy working in your business, I still consult for them, pretty much on a weekly basis, actually, Maureen has been a great mentor to me and very supportive of my new venture, I worked there in a very flexible capacity. Since I guess that was like late 2017, early 2018, when I really started there. And my role evolved, I became, you know, the Director of Business Development eventually, and there were so many great projects I got to work on for them that, you know, I've just learned so much from doing the work. Right. So I, that was a great stepping stone, to, you know, where I am now, which was then launching my own business,
Michele 16:20
You know, I think sometimes we miss the transferable skills, we really do, even those that say, Well, I've never worked in corporate, but if you've managed a home with children, if you have, heck, if you've ever been a babysitter, I mean, if you've just like been responsible for keeping a pet alive, right there, there are transferable skills to all things. It's interesting. I've seen a lot of people come out of the legal environment. I've seen people come out of nursing environments, a lot of school teachers, or people with teaching backgrounds. There's so many skill set triage, right? What's most important, what's least important? What do we do? What's critical path like all of those ways of thinking the strategies, even if thinking or behaving, they're so useful when you build a business, if you can stop and recognize what is it that I'm bringing into this that I just either no have learned or inherently do. And now what are the the areas that I might need more support in. So I love seeing how your schooling and then your first career gave you a skill set that you could parlay into the second. And I have to laugh, you know, as if we didn't have another thing in common. When I came home with my kids, I put them in the preschool at our church. And then next thing you know, I'm over there, because this is back in the oh, gosh, this is in the early 90s. So I'm over there, or late 90s I'm over there creating their computer systems to keep up with all the kids because they didn't have computer systems in preschools back then. So I'm implementing an interviewing computer companies, because that's what I done. And now I'm helping next thing you know, I'm on the board of directors for the preschool. So it's all of that, like, I'm like, okay, yeah, because I was just trying to find a way to stay busy, and to stay involved and to do something like I can only I can only do so much craft paper wrapping paper, right? You know,
Kaitlin Brophy 18:14
I think that goes to the season thing. You're saying like, you know, you're in this season of being, you know, the primary caregiver and home and everything that goes into that, because there's, you know, there's so much there's not only that child rearing, but also with everything with the home and your life. But then you want to be involved, because you are this other person, you know, you've got these skills and these things that make you tick. And so I think, recognizing that, okay, stepping out of the workforce, or stepping back from the workforce, and maybe whatever class you're in, doesn't mean you're not going to go back into it, or that you're not improving upon yourself and gaining new skills, or, you know, we're continuing to build on what you already have. And so I think that I just always like thought of that during that phase. And while I am still, you know, primary caregiver, and my my season has changed that said, I do have more time during the day now to focus on what I'm doing now broken out and you know, outdoor furniture,
Michele 19:16
and accessories. How did you come up with the name Brook and Elm?
Kaitlin Brophy 19:19
So at the time, my husband actually has his own business as well. And this was the corners of the streets in our town where he has office space. So yes, I live in a very small beach town in Massachusetts, and it's a very tiny place and the downtown is only this big and the two intersecting streets are Brook and Elm.
Michele 19:42
That's cool. Well, at least the people locally can remember that right?
Kaitlin Brophy 19:47
That's what I'm trying to build a really robust local business. And you know, right now that's what I'm focused on. I want to serve the south shore of Boston Cape and islands, which for my surrounding geography, that's what I really want to focus on right now.
Michele 20:04
Have you ever had a hard time or a difficult time expressing to people the importance of outdoor spaces? You know, my husband and I, we've been in our home for 25 years, and it's gone through multiple iterations and back in I think it was late 2017 3am In October, at 80 to 90 year old oak tree fell on our house. Talk about shot gunning you out of the bed I we thought like we've we literally thought a plane or a car something had our house the whole house But long story short, it hit the back deck, and it came in through our main family room. Well, we had always wanted screened in back porch. But we just had not gotten around to it. Well, now the whole back porch was not like everything we had on the back deck was gone. We had a hole in the roof. It's pouring rain the next day, like we it was a hot mess. So we made the decision. Well, we've got to rebuild the whole back of the house. Anyway, we had to replace ridge beams it crack the ridge beam in the house like it did damage. We gotta replace all this anyway, why don't we build a more outdoor space? And so we we have the, you know, all the furniture, we've got the big farm table out there, we got a TV out there. And it is the place that a lot of my friends will call and say, Michele, can we come have a porch sit like Nash. The thing among my friends is we have porch sits, which means there's some conversation that needs to be had, or there's something I need to talk through, or I just want to sit and chill. And they come over and we sit on the backboard. Right, right. And it's just, we have a TV out there. We have a heater out there. We've got all the summer classic furniture, we've got all the things. And my husband said to me, why did we wait so long to do this, because of the way that the back of our house is situated where on the porch is off the second floor, but our house is tall from the back. So it looks like in the summer and in the spring and in the early fall like we're sitting in the trees. So we looks like we're in a tree house. And his comment was, I feel like I've taken a vacation when I walk out that back door. Like it feels like I am leaving the difficulties in the daily life. And I just wonder why I didn't do that so much earlier, right to enjoy it even longer. And I just wonder if if that's kind of the conversation that you have with your clients, or if they already recognize that, you know, how that goes.
Kaitlin Brophy 22:34
Sorry to interrupt most clients, when they approached me, I've already recognized that they want this done, they value the service, they, you know, I probably would have had a harder time with this business if I'd open it pre pandemic. But I think the pandemic taught everyone how important is to have outdoor spaces that they want to spend time in and really make fun and functional. So it's funny how life works, right? Like I think I just started even though I'd had the idea pre 2020 By that I didn't open formally open, you know, for my LLC and start my business until you know, April, May of 2020. So it was right when people were starting to be eager to do something in their backyard and the idea did come to me when I was on vacation, inspired by all this amazing, the lounge chairs and the dining areas and the outdoor planters and the lanterns and how it all just came together to make you feel so relaxed and so great. And so, you know, I love being able to help my clients build something that's super relaxing for them to spend time in with their family and friends. That also looks really great.
Michele 23:45
Yeah, what was interesting for us through and thankfully, all of that happened to us pre COVID So that we had it, but you know, some of our friends, they felt like we could hang out on the back porch and we also have a big back patio with a fire pit. They felt like we could hang out there together safely because we had more space and fresh air than we would have inside our home. And so it was a sweet time to be able to be careful. But to also be outside like I we actually through COVID went out and I told my husband said we've got to find more ways to be outside like I cannot be inside anymore. And so first thing we did in early 21 We went bought a boat I'm like I've got a bit of fat if we get locked down again, I need to be able to get out and get my backyard I got to get out in a way right?
Kaitlin Brophy 24:34
Yes, I think people have that in their minds you know it's still pretty fresh right? It's only January 2023 is we're talking so it's not so long ago we were all really stuck at home and you know the one way you could safely see people was outside so you know we live in a small neighborhood with you know the family that had the pool that's guessing that we were over there their house quite a bit just all hanging out gathering. So I think you know we really do as society recognize the importance of outdoor spaces now, and I just really want to help those who want to improve upon theirs make it the best they can, you know, whichever, whatever that is. So I mean, I take all types of projects were outdoor spaces, and I, you know, I don't do the landscape design or the landscaping or the hardscaping, I have a great network of people that I recommend for that. And so I get called into projects where a lot of times people think they're just, you know, ready to go, and we're going to order the furniture and blah, blah, blah, but then they realize there's maybe more to the project than they initially thought, and I can help guide them to, maybe you should talk to this landscape architecture, you know, the space is great, why don't you just talk to this hardscape or, and then, and then we can do this or we can, you know, add that fire pit, we can do an outdoor, bar, kitchen, you know, some pool houses, you know, we do porch, patio, pool houses, you name it, we do it. So it's just a very specific service we offer and I like being able to focus on that.
Michele 25:59
What has been the biggest challenges to starting, number one, your business, but number two of business that is so niche?
Kaitlin Brophy 26:07
So there's a couple. Initially, I'd say one of the biggest challenges was just having the confidence in myself to say out loud that I had to design business that, you know, I'm an attorney, I'm still a licensed attorney, even though I don't practice. So getting over that, and being able to speak confidently, and saying that, a that I have my own business, and then I just it's a design focused business. And then when I set up Brook and Elm, have, like I said, it's been a very slow, intentional growth plan. So I created my mission statement, you know, and I created, I thought about what Mark meant the core values of this company are going to be, I think it's important to be able to say, with confidence, and you know, very colloquially, what I do, and what I do is, you know, we offer, inviting sophisticated outdoor spaces, we do this through offering you know, design services, and stylish outdoor furniture and accessories. We really pride ourselves on our diligence and creativity and our integrity and respect and respect. Those are my core values for my company. And I try to make sure that we stay true to those on every project. So just having the competence to talk about my business publicly was a big challenge initially, honestly, social media has been an ongoing pressure and challenge for me how to do it well and be authentic. I am not a big poster or scroller in my personal life, and I had it do it, but sporadically and in not even daily. So. But I recognize as a business owner, especially a design-oriented business, how important it is to have a robust social media presence these days. So I did actually recently hire a freelance social media coordinator to help me just sort of craft my plan there. And that's been really helpful. I've actually used a lot of freelance workers in these last few years, as I've set up for now, not only to build my website, but you know, now with social media with, you know, helping with my copy my branded materials, and I would really encourage anyone who's starting their own business to look to their freelance community, and tap into those services, because it's great, especially if you can bind maybe very talented junior people who are just coming up. Because, you know, it was important to me when I started this business to not really tap into our family finances, like this was something I was wanting to do on my own and try to make money from it. But there's a lot that needs to go into setting up a business to have it look, the way you want to present yourself.
Michele 28:53
Exactly. You know what's interesting. I know when I started my business, all the way back in 2000. It took a little bit for me to own that I wasn't Michele, software engineer, you know, the things that I had, I'm going to put in air quotes gone to school for the things that I had been known for the things that I had gotten accolades for, but instead to turn to say, I'm Michele, business owner. And so it's interesting to hear you share kind of the same sentiment, it's really coming into the owning right of who we are and what we have created. I think it's also interesting to recognize and over time, it's taken me at the very beginning, I didn't get it, I got it, but it didn't get it. I didn't always introduce myself as Michele, the business owner, I might introduce myself by what I did, but not by business owner. And what we do is such a small part of owning and running an entire company is interesting. I was talking to one of my best friend last night, and she's recently started a company and we were just having that very real conversation of doing a particular or a task or role or job without having to own the social media, the branding, the communications, the conversation, the cash in the cash out without having to be ultimately responsible for all the legal all the financial, all the marketing, all the operations and the doing of the job. That is one different role than I am a designer, it's very different than I am a business coat, it's different, because we could go do these things for other companies. And they would have to own all of the pressure that would keep them up at night around that we don't. But when you own it all, it's different. And so I can even go back through my journey, Kaitlin and see where I started by kind of embracing the fact that I could do the role or tasks that my job that my company did, then I could see that I was kind of owning the financial aspects. And I could see that I was owning the operations. So there's a growth pattern, I think that goes in to so there's so much more than just I design. Yes. And there's so much more right I have and how many people and no offense to anybody listening, because we've all done it at some point. But that'd be like saying, Oh, I've got a camera, I can take pictures. Therefore I'm going to open a photography studio. That's very different than saying I take pictures. I told my girlfriend last night, I'm like, Well, I can bake a cake. I guess I can go open a bakery. It's not the same, right? In E Myth revisited. They talked about that at the very beginning. And I think each of us has that journey to realize you're not only a designer, you are a business owner, who happens to own a firm that offers design services, right? And in that in the building and doing of that you design, right? So not minimizing what we do by just talking about the tasks that we might perform.
Kaitlin Brophy 31:47
Yes. And for me, I feel like that's when I finally figure out how, how to answer that question. When someone asks, oh, what do you do, I say, Oh, I have a small business, it's focuses on outdoor spaces, we offer design services, and outdoor furniture and accessories. And you know, I don't lead with I'm a designer, you know, it just it took me a while to figure out how to say it, that I felt good about it. And I felt like it represented who and who I am and what my company does. And now I can say no problem.
Michele 32:13
Exactly, it takes a while though, doesn't it to kind of come into that on our own, to really embrace the fullness of what you're creating, and what you're trying to do.
Kaitlin Brophy 32:22
And I think you know, my work at interior details over those last few years, and growing in that role in that job. And it was in a design-oriented business, that all they do is custom window treatments. And so in that, you know, one of my projects was helping redesign the showroom, and all the displays. And, you know, I mean, got, you know, we redid the floors, we set up things differently, we did all new, you know, the displays are still in process, but they're almost done it. So just kind of gaining that design experience. From that role. I actually am in the certificate program at New York Institute of Art and Design. So just like little things that for me personally, and you know, everyone's journey and story is different. But those are things that I felt made me feel more confident and made me more comfortable talking the talk and walking the walk. And so I would encourage people to think about that, for those of you. Yes, I've done a lot of home projects, too, and helped a lot of family, my parents recently built a new home, and I did a lot there with my mom helping her, you know, with everything. But for me, I did want that little bit of extra education so that I can see that and hold on to that.
Michele 33:34
Well. And I think that that's the point we're actually trying to make here too, rght? Is that it's not just one journey, there is the journey where you go to school for design, because you know, from a young age, and that's what you do, when you get all the design credentials. There's another journey that says I'm coming at it from a second, you know, maybe very different career. There are so many ways to come at it. And there's space for all of them. I know I work with some women who they want to full time on a huge firm, and I help them build that. I know some that say I want to, you know, work more part time in my business until I can get my kids to this point. There are so many ways to do it. One of the things that I love is that you were you read you mentioned you read profit first and that you were familiar with that. And I really think that by you creating a more limited scope and offering but with intentionality that has put you in a position probably to be more profitable quickly because you're not having to do everything at the outset. Right. I hope you can actually write but you can learn more like I don't mean this in a bad way. But if you think about it, even the vendors there's a more limited amount of vendors when you're looking at one type of space than if you're looking at every space that could possibly be in a home. You're looking at small All our catalog, smaller offerings, still still thorough, but you're not having to be responsible for every single knowledge point and building,
Kaitlin Brophy 35:09
limited and focused. And, you know, and even in most outdoor projects are limited and focused, you know, yes, it might be a big yard with multiple spaces, but basically, it's that space. And then it's done. It's not a home can go on for years. You know, there's multiple living areas, you know, there's the dining area, the kitchen, the bathrooms, the bedrooms, and so there's just so much and I, at this point in my journey was not ready to take that on fully. And so I love the idea of being focused on a very specific niche industry, and really trying to know those vendors that I decided to work with, well, and what's you know, what they offer where, and how to how they complement each other. And, you know, and really understanding how the products function, I live in New England, I mean, we have the weather pattern here, you know, it was snowing yesterday morning when I woke up, and it's 52 degrees today. So you know, we need the all weather materials here, we need, you know, we need things that last and can sustain against the elements. So just building my knowledge base on those things, is great, and I enjoy doing that. But I think it also helps set me apart when people maybe come to the realization that they want to do something outside and where to begin.
Michele 36:26
I think it's also great, because you can find subcontractors that support what you do, like you had talked about the landscape architects, and again, it's a smaller community of subs, you know, then I've got to have like this stable of 14 electricians and, you know, 13 plumbers, you still need some of those same people, but it's just, it's just very, very different and very specific.
Kaitlin Brophy 36:51
And it works for me, and by no means am I trying to encourage people to just have one little area they do and design because, you know, that's some people are meant to do everything, and they're so good. And so, you know, it's really like to each their own, and what works for one doesn't work for all. And I'm a big believer in that, you know, I have a vision for you know, my company, where it's going to be, you know, in two years and five years, and hopefully 10 years, and I'm okay with a slow growth, you know, build and plan because that's what works for me and my family. And that just wouldn't work for everyone. So I think it's just recognizing what brings you fulfillment and joy, and, you know, in success, a feeling of success, you know, and so it goes back to profitability, right? Like, there your definition of profitability and what it means to you. And yes, I have to be financially profitable, like to make money on every project. But it's a real balance for me too, because I'm balancing it against my family, and you know, Mom time and lifetime and all the other things that go into being a wife, a mom, volunteering at the school, still and being present, being active in my community, so people can do it all. But you know, for me, this is how I can wake up and not feel super stressed out.
Michele 38:13
So I always love just thinking about, we can do it all. But when I don't know that we're meant to do it all at once. And so what I look at with profitability is what can I do in this season with joy, so that it doesn't feel like I'm regretting being with my business when I should be with my family, or I'm feeling regret that I'm in the wrong place, or that I'm not being mentally and emotionally present. Because I'm so busy somewhere else. And so, I think the profitability, again, is not just the money, it's the profitability of learning, the profitability of being who I was created to be. And, but also having the life that I want to live, you know, my workday looks very different today 23 years in than it did when I first started my business very different.
Kaitlin Brophy 39:01
And I hope I will too, like that's what I see myself working towards, you know, I envision you know, hiring in fact, you know, we went studio space we have goals for you know, this year by the end of the year, is 2023 2024 goal is to have studio space and to bring someone on as a junior designer slash social media coordinator, because that's where I would really feel we I would benefit most if I could have someone to fill that social media role for me and you know, complement my skill set. So if I'm out, helping grow the business and leading the design, I would love someone to help me with the procurement and the stages of fulfillment, as well as staying on to focus on social media. But, you know, my workday is, you know, essentially the hours my kids are in school with two days that I tend to work a little bit longer. So, you know, I am having a regular sitter here who helps me with the driving the logistics of our life. And so, yes, I do need to be financially profitable. This is not a hobby, right. In fact, this is a career move, and it needs to, you know, pay for my time. But my workday five years from now should be quite different than what it is today, you know,
Michele 40:16
Right, I watch the seasons of mind changes, they get to elementary, then as they get to middle school, then as they get to high school, and then when they went to college, but even summers home when they were home, or you know what it might look like. And I'm now like, right now, I could work as much as I wanted. And that's not always healthy either. So now I'm having to put where, in the past, we had boundaries around our workday, based on what the kids needs, were like, We need to run them here, drive them there, go to this sporting event, go to this drumline event, whatever it was they were involved in. But now I have nobody else asking for that time. So if I don't put my own personal boundaries around it, it's easy for me to sit here, especially with two companies to just work and work. And we're and I love working, I enjoy it, I get fulfillment out of this. But at the same time, you know, my husband's kind of like, hello, I'm still over here, could we, you know, go for a walk or go out to dinner. And then we're now looking at aging parents, and we're looking at with married children, you know, within the next five, seven years, we're probably going to have grandchildren. And so what might that look like, I don't know that I want to be sitting here, that's going to give me an another reason to maybe put some boundaries around some of my work time. So that I can be that grandmother that I want to be the same way it was able to be mom. And I think that is the beauty of owning our companies and building them is we get to build them for the life we want to have. And Kaitlin, I know that we didn't go directly there. But I know that you've had the conversation with your husband just based on the way our conversation has gone. And my husband and I are having it now. What is what do we want our life to look like? What is what is the outdoor element of our life? Like? What is the indoor element? Like? What does our travel plans look like? How much do we how close? Do we want to be, you know, in proximity to our children live? Because we've been looking at do we renovate our home? Or do we move? And if we move how do we? How do we be the grandparents that we want to be in a few years and we can't expect? You know, our sons and their wives with a one-year-old to always be the traveling people. So you know where it was happening with our parents, like all these live conversations are starting to occur, because of the next seat, the season we're in, and the ones we're walking into. And I just don't want the listeners to miss the opportunity that we get to build the life and the business that we desire. And so doing those constant check ins with yourself and constant check ins with the other people in your life to say what is it that we're building? Because if we don't do that, I can tell you from my own experience, the business can get away from me, it can grow faster than you want it to grow, it can go in a direction you didn't intend for it to go. Without that intentionality.
Kaitlin Brophy 42:59
Definitely, I think intentionality is so important. And yes, I've had that conversation many times with my husband about what I what we're doing together what I'm doing in this role, how it all works, you know, with our goals for our family and for our own careers. And you know, I think when you have an intentional plan, and you break it down into smaller, more manageable goals, for me, that makes me feel like I'm working towards something that's exciting, but doable. And so right now, it's about being very specific about who my ideal client is. And you know, the jobs I take on, you know, being busy trying to market this business, but also being intentional about the types of projects we work on. So that I can be available to my family and the way I want to be. And that gives me a lot of satisfaction and makes me feel good. But I really do love what I'm building with this business. And so yeah, for me wanting to build my own business was important so that I could have the flexibility and control over my time. And I think the way I continue to hopefully do that is you know, something I've learned from you as well. And some other podcasts I listened to is just you know, the importance of time blocking and, and having systems and processes in place because they basically help you just be more efficient and keep everything rolling and working well, so that you're not waking up in middle of night or staying up super late or waking up super early to kind of do that hamster wheel.
Michele 44:28
So Kaitlin, as we wrap up, tell everybody where they can find you. What's your social media, your website, where are you hanging out?
Kaitlin Brophy 44:35
So it's BrookandElm.com and my handle is @brookandelm. It's very quite easy to find me, we are in Cohasset Massachusetts, and we focus on creating inviting outdoor spaces.
Michele 44:52
It's amazing what you've built, and I think you've done a beautiful job at it. Thank you so much for joining us today, and we'll have all of your information in our show notes.
Kaitlin Brophy 45:00
Okay, thanks so much. Michele was so nice to meet you and to have this conversation, I really appreciate the opportunity. And you've been so helpful to me my own journey. So thank you.
Michele 45:08
You're very welcome. Thank you, Kaitlin, for joining us on the podcast today. It was really a delight to hear how you have built your business being very intentional niching down from the beginning. And honestly stair stepping not feeling like you've had to go from a career to being a mom with the five young children to building this huge conglomerate. And so thank you for just sharing with us how you are building based on the season that you're in.
Michele 45:39
If you're watching this or if you're listening to this podcast, I would love for you to reach out and let me know the type of business you're building. Let me know what your intentionality plan is. And if you need help, either building a business strategy, or building a business with goals that are very actionable that you want to follow, head over to scarletthreadconsulting.com and fill out a discovery form let's get on the phone and talk about how we can support you in building the business that you want with intention. being intentional creates profit and profit doesn't happen by accident. Profit is a Choice is proud to be part of the designnetwork.org where you can discover more design media reaching creative listeners. Thanks for listening, and stay creative and business minded.